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JW v State Mull deposition 01363

JW v State Mull deposition 01363

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Transcript Stephen Mull
Date: June 2016
Case: Judicial Watch, Inc. -v- U.S. Department State
Planet Depos, LLC
Phone: 888-433-3767
Fax: 888-503-3767
Email: transcripts@planetdepos.com
Internet: www.planetdepos.com
Worldwide Court Reporting Interpretation Trial Services THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
FOR THE DISTRICT COLUMBIA
JUDICIAL WATCH, INC.,
Plaintiff, Civil Action No.
U.S. DEPARTMENT STATE,
Defendant. 13-cv-1363(EGS)
Videotaped Deposition STEPHEN MULL
Washington,
Friday, June 2016
10:05 a.m.
Job No.:
111881
Reported by:
Debra Whitehead
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Videotaped Deposition STEPHEN MULL, held
the offices of:
U.S. DEPARTMENT JUSTICE Massachusetts Avenue,
Washington, 20035
(202) 514-3319
Pursuant notice, before Debra Whitehead,
Approved Reporter the United States District Court
and Notary Public the District Columbia.
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 BEHALF PLAINTIFF:
MICHAEL BEKESHA, ESQUIRE
RAMONA COTCA, ESQUIRE
JAMES PETERSON, ESQUIRE
PAUL ORFANEDES, ESQUIRE
JUDICIAL WATCH, INC.
425 Third Street,
Suite 800
Washington, 20024
(202) 646-5172 BEHALF DEFENDANT:
STEVEN MYERS, ESQUIRE
ELIZABETH SHAPIRO, ESQUIRE
MARCIA BERMAN, ESQUIRE
LARA NICOLE BERLIN, ESQUIRE
U.S. DEPARTMENT JUSTICE
CIVIL DIVISION Massachusetts Avenue,
Washington, 20530
(202) 514-2205
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
ALSO PRESENT:
MELISSA CALL, Department Justice
DEREK FOX, Video Specialist
THOMAS FITTON, President, Judicial Watch
GREGORY LAUDADIO, Judicial Watch
CAROLINE WOLVERTON, Department Justice
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
EXAMINATION STEPHEN MULL Mr. Bekesha
PAGE
(Attached the Transcript)
DEPOSITION EXHIBIT
PAGE
Exhibit
E-mail String
Exhibit
E-mail String
Exhibit
1/28/11 E-mail from Mr. Crowley Ms. Mills, al.
Exhibit
E-mail String
Exhibit
E-mail String
Exhibit
E-mail String
Exhibit
January 2016 Evaluation the
Department States FOIA
Processes
the Office the Secretary
Exhibit
for Requests Involving
May 2016 Office the Secretary:
Evaluation Email Records
Management and Cybersecurity
Requirements
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
DEPOSITION EXHIBIT
Exhibit
PAGE
1996 Secretarial Transition
Background Materials, Office
the Secretary Administrative
Support, Procedures, and Staffing,
122
November 1996
Exhibit
No. 96-009 S/S-EX Administrative
Procedure, Subject:
Records
Management
PLANET DEPOS
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131
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Here begins Tape Number
10:04:49 the videotaped deposition Stephen Mull
10:04:57
the matter Judicial Watch, Inc., versus U.S.
10:05:03
Department State, the United States District
10:05:07
Court for the District Columbia; Civil Action
10:05:10
Number 13-CV-1363.
10:05:14
VIDEO SPECIALIST:
10:04:49
Todays date June 3rd, 2016. the video monitor 10:05.
The time
The videographer
today Derek Fox, representing Planet Depos.
This video deposition taking place Massachusetts Avenue, Northwest, Washington, DC.
Would counsel please voice-identify
themselves and state whom they represent.
MR. BEKESHA:
Michael Bekesha, behalf Judicial Watch.
10:05:25
10:05:30
10:05:35
10:05:39
10:05:44
10:05:46
10:05:49
10:05:50
MR. ORFANEDES:
Paul Orfanedes, behalf Judicial Watch.
MS. COTCA:
10:05:21
10:05:50
10:05:50
Ramona Cotca, behalf
Judicial Watch.
MR. PETERSON:
10:05:53
10:05:53
James Peterson, behalf Judicial Watch.
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
10:05:53
10:05:53
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
MS. SHAPIRO:
Elizabeth Shapiro, behalf the Department State.
10:06:01
MS. WOLVERTON:
behalf the Department State.
MS. BERLIN:
Caroline Wolverton,
Lara Berlin, Department
State.
Marcy Berman, Department
State.
MR. MYERS:
Department State.
Steven Myers, for the
Tom Fitton, President
Judicial Watch.
10:06:09
10:06:11
10:06:17
10:06:17
MR. LAUDADIO:
Gregory Laudadio, Judicial
Watch.
10:06:21
10:06:24
VIDEO SPECIALIST:
10:06:06
10:06:12
MR. FITTON:
10:06:05
10:06:11
10:06:01
10:06:07
MS. BERMAN:
10:05:53
The court reporter
10:06:25
today Debbie Whitehead, representing Planet
10:06:25
Depos.
10:06:25
Would the reporter please swear the
witness.
10:06:25
10:06:25
STEPHEN MULL,
having been duly sworn, testified follows:
MR. MYERS:
And Ambassador Mull reserves
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
10:06:25
10:06:36
10:06:36
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
the right read and sign the end the
10:06:38
deposition.
10:06:40
EXAMINATION COUNSEL FOR PLAINTIFF MR. BEKESHA:
10:06:43
10:06:43
Good morning, Mr. Mull. name
Michael Bekesha.
Watch.
one Judicial Watchs Freedom Information Act
10:06:51
lawsuits against the Department State,
10:06:54
specifically questions surrounding the creation,
10:06:56
purpose, and use the Clintonemail.com system
10:06:59
then Secretary State Hillary Clinton and Huma
10:06:59
Abedin, conduct official government business.
10:07:02 here ask you few questions about
Before begin, could you please state attorney with Judicial
10:06:43
and spell your name, for the record.
Sure.
10:06:48
10:07:05
10:07:07 Stephen, S-T-E-P-H-E-N, Mull,
M-U-L-L.
10:06:45
10:07:09
10:07:13
Thank you.
Also, before begin, would
10:07:15
like over few ground rules.
Your counsel
10:07:17
may have already talked you about them, but
10:07:19
will hopefully help the deposition more smoothly.
10:07:21 you dont hear one questions
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
10:07:24
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
dont understand one questions, please let
10:07:26
know.
10:07:29
question.
Happy repeat the question rephrase the
10:07:31
Also, its important that you respond out
loud. you shake your hand head make any
hand gestures, the court reporter cant record that.
10:07:32
10:07:34
10:07:37
Also, things will lot more smoothly
10:07:40 you wait until done answering the questions
10:07:43 your counsel done objecting.
10:07:45
Its lot
easier for the court reporter record were not
10:07:47
speaking over each other.
10:07:50
With that, could you just give brief
10:07:52
background about your tenure the State
10:07:55
Department?
10:07:57
Yes. Foreign Service Officer since
1982.
domestic assignments. currently serve the U.S.
10:08:07
governments lead coordinator for the implementation
10:08:07 the Iran nuclear deal.
10:08:11 have served variety overseas posts and
10:07:57
Thank you.
Were primarily going focus your time Executive Secretary.
But before
get there, just had couple questions about some
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
10:08:00
10:08:13
10:08:17
10:08:19
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 your previous posts.
Between 1998 and 2000, you were Deputy
Executive Secretary the State Department?
10:08:22
10:08:23
10:08:28
Yes.
10:08:29
And what were your responsibilities
10:08:30
that role?
10:08:32 was responsible for coordinating
10:08:34
Secretary Albrights travel Europe and
10:08:37
international organization events, well events
10:08:43 the former Soviet Union; coordinating the policy
10:08:46
support for her engagement issues involving those
10:08:52
areas; and supervising subcomponents the
10:08:56
Executive Secretariat.
10:09:01
Did any those subcomponents include
responding FOIA requests document requests?
There were people the Executive
10:09:02
10:09:05
10:09:10
Secretariat responsible for handling the processing
10:09:13 those.
10:09:16
for that. did not have immediate responsibility
10:09:19 was another Deputy Secretary that had
that responsibility, you recall?
Well, the responsibility for FOIA requests
PLANET DEPOS
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10:09:20
10:09:22
10:09:25
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
typically rests with what later came known
10:09:31
the Office for Correspondence and Records.
One
10:09:35
the Deputys executive secretaries would have been
10:09:41
responsible for supervising that office.
10:09:42
Okay.
But that wasnt you.
10:09:43 think part the time cant
10:09:45
remember.
supervised it.
10:09:53
10:09:55
from about August 2008 June 2009, you were the
10:10:00
senior advisor the Undersecretary State for
10:10:03
Political Affairs?
10:10:06
Okay.
10:09:51
And then from 2009 sorry,
Part the time had had that
Yes, was that for those dates.
But
continued that role until June 2010.
Okay.
All right.
And you were working
10:10:09
10:10:12
10:10:14
the Undersecretary for Political Affairs, Bill
10:10:22
Burns, the time?
10:10:25
Thats right, yes.
10:10:26
Okay.
10:10:26 you were that position when
Mrs. Clinton became Secretary State.
Yes.
Okay.
10:10:29
10:10:32
Did you, while you were that
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
10:10:33
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
position, did you ever e-mail, correspond with
10:10:38
Mrs. Clinton via e-mail?
10:10:42
Not that recall.
10:10:43
Okay.
10:10:43
Did you know her e-mail address
during that time period?
No.
Okay.
10:10:46
10:10:47
And then, you said, after you
10:10:47
were after that position you became the Executive
10:10:50
Secretary?
10:10:55
Yes.
10:10:56
And when did that start?
10:10:56 June 2010.
10:10:59
And how did that come about? that
Senate-confirmed position?
10:11:00
10:11:04
No.
Okay.
The Secretary State.
10:11:13 that position you applied for
10:11:14
10:11:06 who appoints that position?
10:11:06
mean, how how you come about being that
10:11:17
position?
10:11:19
Well, recall the spring 2010 the
Secretarys chief staff, Cheryl Mills, had asked
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
10:11:22
10:11:30
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 would interested being considered for the
10:11:33
job.
10:11:37
time after that was offered the appointment. said yes. interviewed with her, and some
time period? have opportunity meet Ms. Mills?
When did you first know Cheryl Mills
MR. MYERS:
And did you know Cheryl Mills before that
Objection.
10:11:42
10:11:44
10:11:48
10:11:51
Beyond the scope discovery.
10:11:53
10:11:55
You can answer the question.
10:11:56 suppose our offices were were not
10:12:03
that far from each other.
her towards the end 2009, early 2010.
cant recall exactly.
Did you know Mrs. Clinton prior
MR. MYERS:
10:12:05
10:12:08
10:12:12
her becoming Secretary State?
Okay. suppose may have met
Objection.
10:12:13
10:12:16
Beyond the scope authorized discovery.
10:12:17
10:12:19
You may answer the question.
10:12:21
Can you clarify what you mean know?
10:12:22
Sure.
10:12:25
Not know her, but had you had
opportunity meet her prior did you ever work
10:12:29
with her prior she becoming Secretary State?
10:12:33
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 served her control officer when she
10:12:37
visited the American Embassy Poland when worked
10:12:41
there the mid the mid 90s.
10:12:46
Okay. lets prior you becoming
10:12:47
Executive Secretary, who was the Executive
10:12:52
Secretary?
10:12:55
Daniel Smith.
10:12:55
Okay.
10:12:56
And held that position until
June 2010?
Yes.
Okay.
10:12:59
Lets talk little bit more
generally about the Executive Secretariat.
Whats the general purpose the
10:13:00
Executive Secretariat? serves link between the Secretary,
10:13:00
10:13:04
10:13:07
10:13:10
10:13:11
the Deputy Secretaries State, the
10:13:14
undersecretaries the State Department, with the
10:13:17
rest the building, providing administrative,
10:13:20
logistics, communications, and policy formulation
10:13:23
support.
10:13:29
Okay.
And the Executive Secretary the
head that office?
PLANET DEPOS
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10:13:29
10:13:31
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Yes.
Okay.
And approximately how many people
work within the Office the Executive Secretariat?
10:13:33 cant recall exactly, but think its
200, 250 people, perhaps.
Okay.
And then under the Executive
10:13:33
10:13:36
10:13:40
10:13:43
10:13:44
Secretary, you had, was four deputies reporting
10:13:47 you that time?
10:13:50
Yes.
Okay.
10:13:51
And did each them have different
responsibilities?
Okay.
10:13:54
Yes.
10:13:51
10:13:55
Did one those deputies have
10:13:56
responsibility overseeing what guess its
10:14:01
the Office Correspondence and Records?
10:14:05
Yes.
10:14:08
Who was that deputy when you started
10:14:08
2010?
10:14:11 cant recall which the which
the four had line responsibility first year.
Okay. you recall the subsequent years?
Yes.
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
10:14:17
10:14:20
10:14:23
10:14:26
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Okay.
When you first recall who the
deputy was, and what was the time period? second year, from the summer 2011
10:14:27
10:14:30
10:14:31
until left the position 2012, the deputy
10:14:37
responsible for overseeing that office was Pamela
10:14:43
Quanrud.
10:14:46
Could you spell her last name, please?
10:14:46
Yes.
10:14:48
Okay.
Q-U-A-N-R-U-D. you dont recall think you
already did answer this.
had that position before -MR. MYERS:
10:14:58
Objection.
10:15:00 before she came?
10:15:00
10:15:01
Asked and answered.
Was she deputy was she Deputy
Secretary before the summer 2011?
She started Deputy Executive Secretary summer 2011.
10:15:05
10:15:08
10:15:10
10:15:12
Where was she before that; you recall?
10:15:13
MR. MYERS:
10:14:56
MR. MYERS:
But you didnt recall who
10:14:51
10:15:18
Objection.
Beyond the scope authorized discovery.
You may answer the question.
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
10:15:19
10:15:20
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 seem recall she was Deputy
10:15:23
Assistant Secretary the Bureau European and
10:15:26
Eurasian Affairs.
10:15:29
Okay.
What did whats the basic role and
Thank you.
purpose the Office Correspondence and Records? provides archiving responsibilities and
10:15:30
10:15:32
10:15:34
10:15:38
retrieval responsibilities for official documents
10:15:42
that are produced either the briefing policy
10:15:47
formulation process the State Department.
10:15:50 has responsibility for responding
10:15:54
FOIA requests that are routed the Executive
10:15:58
Secretariat from for handling from the Bureau
10:16:03
Administration.
10:16:06
Okay.
And
And for tracking receipt and responses
10:16:07
10:16:08 correspondence the Secretary and other State
10:16:14
Department principals.
10:16:18 guess that leads the next
Does that that office the
10:16:20
question:
records the archival and retrieval for the entire
10:16:25
State Department just for what falls within the
10:16:28
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
10:16:22
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Office the Secretary the Executive
10:16:32
Secretariats?
10:16:35
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague and
compound.
10:16:35
10:16:36
You may answer the question.
10:16:37
For the the Office Correspondence
10:16:39
and Records performed that function for the offices
10:16:44
the Executive Secretariat supported.
10:16:46
Okay.
And what offices were those, you
recall?
10:16:48
10:16:51
Well, said earlier, the Office the
10:16:55
Secretary, the deputy secretaries, the
10:16:57
undersecretaries the State Department, well
10:17:00 number smaller offices that reported directly
10:17:02 the Secretary State.
10:17:05
Okay.
And how much interaction would you
10:17:06
have guess who was the director the Office
10:17:10 Correspondence and Records during your time
10:17:14
period?
10:17:15
Mr. Clarence Finney.
10:17:16
Did change was consistent from
10:17:17
2010 through 2012 when you left?
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
10:17:21
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague.
Was just one person, did that
10:17:23
10:17:25
change, did that office change hands some point
10:17:28
during your tenure?
10:17:30 tenure.
moving merge that office with the Office
10:17:38
Secretariat staff.
10:17:42
Towards the end tenure began
place? was the director that office during
Okay.
And when did that merger take
10:17:33
10:17:42
10:17:44 think was cant remember
10:17:44 think formally took place after
10:17:46
exactly.
departure.
10:17:31
Okay.
10:17:48 you know approximately how many
employees worked for Mr. Finney?
10:17:49
10:17:52 cant recall exactly.
10:17:54
Okay.
How much interaction did you have
10:17:57
with Mr. Finney during your two years Executive
10:17:59
Secretary?
10:18:06
Usually once, once day.
10:18:06
Okay.
10:18:07
And reported directly not going pronounce Pamelas last name
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
10:18:15
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
correctly.
Could you remind how you pronounce
that?
10:18:22
Quanrud.
Quanrud.
10:18:19
10:18:23 reported directly
her?
10:18:23
10:18:26
Yes, during the
10:18:26
During the
10:18:26 time that she had, yes.
10:18:27
Okay.
10:18:28
And how frequently would you talk Ms. Quanrud about issues within the Office
10:18:30
Correspondence and Records?
10:18:37
Not very often. couldnt quantify it.
10:18:38
Okay.
Would you you had questions
10:18:42 there were issues within that office, would
10:18:45
you talk Mr. Finney, would you talk
10:18:48
Ms. Quanrud first?
10:18:50
was bureaucracy involved hierarchy?
MR. MYERS: just trying get sense,
Objection.
Vague and
compound.
10:18:56
10:18:57 you understand the question, you may
answer.
10:18:53
10:18:57
10:18:59
Well, would have daily staff
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
10:19:02
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
meeting the Executive Secretariat, all
10:19:06 the deputies and office directors within the
10:19:08
Executive Secretariat.
10:19:15
lasted for minutes.
Those meetings typically
10:19:19 there were issues relating
10:19:20
that office and its operations, would typically
10:19:23
come those meetings.
10:19:26
Okay.
And those meetings would you and
the four Deputy Executive Secretaries?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
10:19:28
10:19:30
Assumes facts not
Mischaracterizes prior testimony.
10:19:32 evidence.
You may answer the question.
10:19:36
Yes.
10:19:38
Okay.
10:19:34
And the office directors.
How many office director
10:19:40
just trying get sense lay the land.
How
many office directors would have been part that
10:19:45
meeting, well?
10:19:47
10:19:42
Usually four.
10:19:59
Okay.
10:20:00
And guess probably would have
been easier, what were those four offices that they
10:20:03
were directors for?
10:20:05
Well, there one the Deputy Executive
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
10:20:07
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Secretaries was dual-hatted the Executive
10:20:10
Director the Executive Office the Executive
10:20:13
Secretariat.
10:20:15
director. was both deputy and office would have been there.
The director the operations center,
10:20:18
10:20:20
State Department operations center, the director
10:20:23
the Secretariat staff, the director
10:20:28
correspondence and records, and the director
10:20:31
the our information management section, S/ES-IRM,
10:20:36
information resources management.
10:20:40
Okay.
And during your tenure was the
director S/ES-IRM, was that John Bentel?
Yes.
Okay.
Was the director your whole time
Yes.
Okay.
Thank you.
Secretariat staff.
10:20:51
10:20:54
10:20:56
10:20:56
You mentioned the office the
10:20:46
10:20:51 when you were Executive Secretary?
10:20:43
What it?
What that?
Secretariat staff also known the
line.
Its office personnel
responsible for both advancing and managing the
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888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
10:20:59
10:21:02
10:21:05
10:21:07
10:21:12
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Secretary States overseas travel, well
10:21:15
managing the paper flow official memoranda and
10:21:19
briefing material from the State Department the
10:21:24
Secretary and other principals the State
10:21:27
Department.
10:21:32
10:21:32
Would that paper flow include issues
related e-mail, was that just official memos?
Could you when you say paper flow,
relating e-mail?
Yeah.
10:21:35
10:21:43
10:21:46 mean, you were just talking about
10:21:47
paper flow, and just wasnt sure some that
10:21:50
paper, some that some those issues included
10:21:52
e-mail correspondence.
10:21:54
Typically not.
These were memoranda,
10:21:57
decision memoranda, policy memoranda, background
10:22:02
papers, talking points for meetings, and and
10:22:05
forth.
10:22:10
During the course assignment
10:22:10
transitioned electronic system for entering
10:22:13
those memoranda.
10:22:17
the definition e-mail.
Okay.
But wouldnt normally fit into
What what system was that that
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10:22:21
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
was you transitioned transitioned into using?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Beyond the scope authorized discovery.
10:22:24
10:22:26
10:22:27
You may answer the question.
10:22:29
The Everest system.
10:22:30
Could you just briefly describe what the
10:22:32
Everest system is?
MR. MYERS:
10:22:37
Objection.
Beyond the scope authorized discovery.
10:22:37
10:22:38
You may answer the question.
10:22:39 was electronic channel for creating
10:22:41
decision briefing memoranda, talking points for
10:22:48
meetings, terms getting clearance within the
10:22:51
State Department and submitting the
10:22:56
Secretarys office.
10:22:59
system for those records, well?
MR. MYERS:
Was the Everest system also archival
Objection.
Beyond the scope authorized discovery.
10:23:00
10:23:04
10:23:06
10:23:07
You may answer the question.
10:23:08
The Everest system was and
10:23:10
searchable.
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Okay.
But was not the official record
Thank you.
10:23:15
function the department.
Okay.
10:23:16
10:23:20
Was there another system that would
10:23:22
have had that official record-keeping archival
10:23:26
system?
10:23:30
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Beyond the scope authorized discovery.
10:23:30
10:23:32
You may answer the question.
10:23:33
Yeah. mean, the correspondence and
10:23:36
records unit would capture those documents
10:23:37
system called, the time, STARS.
10:23:42
Could you talk little bit about STARS,
please?
10:23:50
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Beyond the scope authorized discovery. answer the question.
the discovery thats been authorized the court.
10:23:50
10:23:51
And going instruct the witness not
10:23:47
This has nothing with
Did the STARS system FOIA request
10:23:53
10:23:54
10:23:57
10:24:01
came the office, would the STARS system
10:24:04
searched?
10:24:07
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 dont know.
10:24:09
Okay.
10:24:10 cant recall, guess.
10:24:13
Sure.
10:24:15 can come back that. talked little bit about keep
10:24:19
forgetting the name that office, Office
10:24:22
Correspondence and Records.
10:24:26
Thats S/ES-CR. that correct?
10:24:28
S/ES-CR.
10:24:30
Okay.
10:24:33
And that office was charge
responding FOIA requests?
FOIA requests for
records within the Office the Secretary.
10:24:37
10:24:43
Yes.
10:24:46
Okay.
10:24:46 responsible for channeling the
10:24:48
responsible individuals. guess well take step back,
also.
10:24:54
10:25:09
Youre aware the Freedom Information
Okay.
10:24:53
Act?
10:25:09
10:25:12
Yes.
Okay.
10:25:12
While when you were Executive
PLANET DEPOS
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Secretary, were you trained provided guidance
10:25:16
about the Freedom Information Act?
10:25:19 dont recall formal training.
10:25:23
recall getting briefed the function assumed
10:25:26
the responsibilities.
10:25:30
And what specific responsibilities
10:25:31
did you have when came Freedom Information
10:25:34
Act?
10:25:38 terms immediate work
10:25:39
requirements, dont believe had any specific
10:25:42
within work requirements.
10:25:45
Okay.
However, was ultimately responsible for
10:25:46
everyone the Executive Secretariat, including
10:25:49
those who had line responsibility, for performing
10:25:51
Freedom Information Act activities.
10:25:56
Okay.
Thank you. there was did any staff ever come
10:25:58
10:26:00 you with questions about the Freedom
10:26:04
Information Act?
10:26:08
Not that recall.
10:26:08
Okay.
10:26:09
Were you involved
troubleshooting issues when came the Freedom
PLANET DEPOS
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10:26:10
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 Information Act?
10:26:13 cant recall exactly any particular case which someone would have come me.
possible that the person conducting search,
10:26:26
that the management that office may have asked
10:26:33
for help, but cant terms directing
10:26:37
people responsible.
10:26:40
specific such case.
Okay.
Its
10:26:17
But cant remember any
Thank you.
During your, think you call the
10:26:23
10:26:43
10:26:44
10:26:45
deputy meeting, deputy and director meetings that
10:26:49
you said were daily, did the Freedom Information
10:26:53
Act was discussed during those meetings?
10:26:57 cant recall specific circumstance,
no.
10:26:59
10:27:01
Okay. FOIA requests came concerning
10:27:01
e-mails records Mrs. Clinton while you were
10:27:06
Executive Secretary, you know who would have been
10:27:09
responsible for processing those FOIA requests?
10:27:11
All FOIA requests that were directed
10:27:16
the Executive Secretariat the Bureau
10:27:19
Administration would the working-level
10:27:21
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
contacts within the Office Correspondence and
10:27:25
Records.
10:27:28
They would then responsible for
10:27:28
contacting individual offices for whom the Executive
10:27:31
Secretariat responsible, convey the those
10:27:37
requests.
10:27:41
Okay. you know who those contacts
10:27:42
would have been for the office for Mrs. Clinton,
10:27:44
for the Secretary?
10:27:46 cant recall.
10:27:48
Okay.
10:27:49
And those would have been
individuals that would have reported Mr.
10:27:51
ultimately reported Mr. Finney?
10:27:53
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Mischaracterizes
prior testimony.
10:27:59
When you say report to, you mean
super
10:27:57
10:28:00
10:28:02
Within his office.
They would have would
10:28:03
been was the director CM, CR.
they have been within the the contacts, would
10:28:07
they have been the point contacts that would
10:28:10
have initially received the work think you
10:28:13
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
called them the working level contacts?
10:28:15
Uh-huh.
10:28:17
Would they they were the office that
10:28:17
Mr. Finney was director of?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
10:28:18
Vague and
compound.
10:28:22 youre saying the people did the
people who you mean they?
10:28:21
Sure.
Sure.
10:28:23
10:28:25
No, not you know,
10:28:27
guess just trying get know its the
10:28:30
FOIA requests start with IPS, and then comes
10:28:32 the Executive Secretariat.
10:28:36
wondering you knew who the first point contact
10:28:39
was within the Executive Secretariat when FOIA
10:28:42
request came for records related Mrs. Clinton.
10:28:47 would have been somebody the Office Correspondence and Records.
Okay.
And then once somebody the
10:28:52
10:28:55
10:28:55
Office Correspondence and Records received that
10:28:57
FOIA request, there would another point
10:28:59
contact, depending which specific office within
10:29:03
the Executive Secretariat?
10:29:05
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 the Executive Secretariat was
10:29:09
responsible for performing such functions for
10:29:12
range the range all its clientele, the
10:29:16
Office the Secretary, the deputy secretaries, the
10:29:19
undersecretaries, and number other smaller
10:29:21
offices.
10:29:24
The Office Correspondence and Records,
10:29:24 the procedure was explained me, when they
10:29:28
received such requests, they would then contact each
10:29:31 those offices that the Executive Secretariat
10:29:35
supported, perform followup searches.
10:29:38
Okay. you know who the point
10:29:45
contact would have been within the Office the
10:29:46
Secretary?
10:29:48
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Asked and
answered.
10:29:48
10:29:49
You can answer the question.
10:29:51 dont remember.
10:29:52
Okay.
10:29:52
Thank you. talked little bit about archival,
10:29:58
What about inventorying records when
10:30:01
archiving.
individual left?
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Beyond the
10:30:07
well, objection, beyond the scope discovery, and
10:30:09
its vague and ambiguous.
10:30:11
question is.
10:30:14
10:30:14 dont know what the
Did the office the Executive
Secretariat have any responsibility for inventorying
10:30:17
records when senior official was leaving?
10:30:23
MR. MYERS:
Its beyond the
10:30:25
scope authorized discovery.
And for that reason
10:30:27 going instruct the witness not answer the
10:30:29
question.
10:30:30
Objection.
The Office the Executive Secretariat
10:30:36
was responsible for responding FOIA
10:30:38
requests for certain offices within within the
10:30:41
Office Executive Secretariat.
10:30:46
Correct?
Yes.
10:30:53
Strike
10:30:53
But also for those other offices supported
10:30:54 the Executive Secretariat.
Okay.
10:30:56
The and can through the
10:30:58 just want through the offices.
The Office
10:31:02 the Secretary State, that correct, one
10:31:05
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 them?
10:31:07
Yes.
10:31:08
The Office the Deputy Secretary
10:31:08
State?
10:31:12
Well, there were two departments.
But,
yes, both both the deputies.
Okay.
The Office the Deputy Secretary
for Management Resources?
10:31:13
10:31:15
10:31:17
10:31:21
Yes.
10:31:22
The what about the Office the
10:31:22
Undersecretary for Political Affairs?
10:31:24
Yes.
10:31:26
And then think the last one the
10:31:26
office the counselor the department?
Well, there are number other
10:31:34
undersecretaries well that the Executive
10:31:36
Secretariat supported.
10:31:38
10:31:29
Okay.
10:31:39
Both those, but also others.
10:31:40
What are what are the other ones?
10:31:42
Well, theyve gone through name changes.
10:31:46
When was there was the Undersecretary for
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Economic and Business Affairs, the Undersecretary
10:31:52
for International Security Affairs and Arms Control,
10:31:57
the Undersecretary for, believe was called
10:32:02
Global Affairs, the Undersecretary for Management,
10:32:07
the Undersecretary for Public Public Diplomacy.
10:32:16
Okay.
Thank you.
And there were other additional offices
10:32:19
10:32:24
attached immediately the Office the Secretary
10:32:26 State, satellite offices, for which also
10:32:31
provided support.
10:32:33
Okay.
And FOIA request came
10:32:33
during that time period for records let
10:32:50
rephrase that.
10:32:57 FOIA request came for records
10:33:07
prior either prior Secretary State prior,
10:33:10
you know, Deputy Secretary State Deputy
10:33:16
Secretary for Management Resources, would those
10:33:19
records, was the recent future, would those
10:33:21
records within the records correspondence?
10:33:24
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague, ambiguous,
and beyond the scope authorized discovery.
You can answer the question.
PLANET DEPOS
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10:33:27
10:33:29
10:33:32
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 not sure under the recent future?
10:33:34
Sure.
10:33:36
Record while you were there, FOIA request came for records Secretary
10:33:39
Rice, would those records fall within the scope
10:33:44
the Executive Secretariats responsibilities?
10:33:47
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague, and beyond
the scope authorized discovery.
10:33:52
And dont either cant recall dont know the answer that.
Okay.
10:33:51
While you were while you were
10:33:54
10:33:58
10:33:59 that position, the Undersecretary for Political
10:34:03
Affairs, Bill Burns, left approximately 2011.
10:34:10
Correct?
MR. MYERS:
10:34:13
Objection.
Beyond the scope authorized discovery.
10:34:16
10:34:18
You may answer the question.
10:34:19 cant remember exactly when, but
10:34:20
2011 sounds about right.
Okay.
10:34:23
And, you know, just generally the
10:34:24
Deputy Secretary for Management Resources, Jack Lew,
10:34:28 left sometime during your tenure?
10:34:32
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Foundation, beyond
PLANET DEPOS
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10:34:34
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
the scope authorized discovery.
10:34:35
You may answer the question.
10:34:37
Yes.
10:34:39
Okay. you know either their
10:34:39
their records were inventoried when they left
10:34:42
office?
10:34:45
MR. MYERS:
scope authorized discovery. with FOIA processing Huma Abedin Hillary
10:34:48
Clintons e-mails.
10:34:52
Its beyond the
10:34:45 doesnt have
10:34:47
And for that reason going instruct
Objection.
the witness not answer the question.
MR. BEKESHA:
You know, does fall
10:34:55
10:34:57
within the scope. not how records were processed, were they
10:35:01
processed differently from Mrs. Clinton and
10:35:04
Ms. Abedin, where their records were, how they were
10:35:06
stored, how they were inventoried, how they were
10:35:09
archived.
All these issues fall directly within
10:35:12
the scope and are relevant the processing the
10:35:14
FOIA requests issue this case.
10:35:16
Were looking, you know, whether
10:34:53
MR. MYERS:
Your question not only doesnt
PLANET DEPOS
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10:34:58
10:35:18
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
mention FOIA, doesnt mention Mrs. Clinton
10:35:19
Ms. Abedin.
10:35:22
thats been authorized this case.
ask question about the FOIA processing those
10:35:26
individuals, you should ask that question.
10:35:28
MR. BEKESHA: has nothing with the discovery you want
Sure.
10:35:25
10:35:30
After Mr. Lew left office, how would his
10:35:31
records FOIA request came for those
10:35:37
records, how would they have been processed?
10:35:40
MR. MYERS:
scope authorized discovery.
You may answer the question.
10:35:45
10:35:46
And and going
Again, were here talk about Ms. Abedin
and Ms. Clintons e-mails.
MR. BEKESHA:
10:35:55
10:35:59
10:36:20
MR. MYERS:
VIDEO SPECIALIST:
Could take
two-minute break?
record.
10:35:47
10:35:57
Sure.
10:35:42
10:35:43
instruct you not answer the question.
Its beyond the
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Sure.
10:36:22 are going off the
The time 10:36. recess was taken.)
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10:36:22
10:36:23
10:36:25
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
VIDEO SPECIALIST:
record. are back the MR. BEKESHA:
The time 10:43.
Okay.
10:43:12
10:43:13
10:43:16
Thank you. going move
10:43:16
from where were before and just talk about FOIA
10:43:18
little bit more before move on.
10:43:21 you know the Executive Secretariat
10:43:24
had its own FOIA guidance operating procedures
10:43:26
while you were there?
10:43:30 terms established document ...
10:43:40
Probably document.
10:43:45
Some type
guidance.
10:43:46 cant recall. know that
10:43:48
Mr. Finney was aware his responsibilities, based
10:43:51 his assurances.
10:43:54
there was specific document.
Okay.
But dont cant recall
Okay.
Thank you.
10:43:58
10:43:59 you know the Executive Secretariat
10:44:03
searched electronic e-mails sorry about that
10:44:05
searched electronic e-mail accounts when you were
10:44:11
Executive Secretary?
10:44:14 sorry. response FOIA requests,
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
MR. MYERS:
Objection. this specific
10:44:19 Huma Abedin and the former Secretary, that
10:44:20 general question?
10:44:23
MR. BEKESHA:
MR. MYERS:
Its general question.
Objection. that extent
10:44:24
10:44:25
exceeds those two individuals, its beyond the scope
10:44:27 authorized discovery.
10:44:29
You may answer the question.
10:44:30 sorry.
10:44:34
Sure.
Could you repeat the question?
Did the office the Executive
10:44:35
Secretary search electronic e-mail accounts
10:44:38
response FOIA requests
10:44:41
MR. MYERS:
Same
10:44:42 while you were Executive Secretary?
MR. MYERS:
10:44:43
10:44:44
Same objection.
You may answer the question.
10:44:45
The immediate office, immediate office?
10:44:46
The offices, the Executive Secretariat
10:44:48 guess would have been Mr. Finneys
10:44:54 whole.
office.
10:44:56
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague and
compound.
PLANET DEPOS
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10:44:56
10:44:58
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 cant recall specific specific
case.
10:45:01
10:45:06
Okay. you know how many employees
10:45:06
within the office the Executive Secretariat were
10:45:11
trained FOIA-related issues?
10:45:14
What you mean trained?
10:45:20
Either provided guidance went
10:45:21
one-day seminar.
terms.
Training could have many different you know they think you
10:45:25
10:45:29
mentioned you dont know they were provided
10:45:32
memorandum about processing FOIA requests.
10:45:35 dont -MR. MYERS:
10:45:38
Objection.
Compound.
10:45:38 dont recall such memorandum.
10:45:40 you recall any seminars being held
10:45:42
about FOIA obligations within for the for
10:45:44
employees within the office the Executive
10:45:48
Secretariat?
10:45:51
No, dont recall.
10:45:54
Are you aware March 2010 Associated
10:45:56
Press FOIA request for records Mrs. Clinton? dont believe so, no.
PLANET DEPOS
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10:46:03
10:46:10
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Okay.
Were going move for now from
10:46:11
FOIA-related issues and talk little bit about the
10:46:15
S/ES-IRM department.
10:46:19
Uh-huh.
10:46:22
And you said that could you talk
10:46:22
little bit about what the purpose that office is?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Calls for
narrative response.
10:46:27
10:46:29
10:46:30
You may answer the question.
10:46:32
Responsible for providing information
10:46:34
management support for State Department principals,
10:46:36
principally through the POEMS electronic mail
10:46:39
system.
10:46:42
And what does POEMS stand for, you
recall?
10:46:42
10:46:45
Principal officers electronic mail system.
10:46:47
Okay.
10:46:51
And thats separate office from
general office within the Department State?
Yes.
Okay.
10:46:57
10:47:00
And that office, theres IRM
office for the State Department generally? that correct?
PLANET DEPOS
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10:47:00
10:47:04
10:47:06
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 which office?
10:47:07 guess there IRM office within the
10:47:08
office the Executive Secretariat, and then
10:47:13
theres IRM office guess that falls under the
10:47:15
office Undersecretary for Management?
10:47:19
Yes.
10:47:21
MR. MYERS:
THE WITNESS:
MR. MYERS:
Yes.
Objection.
10:47:21
Sorry.
10:47:22
You can answer the question.
Theres Bureau for Information
10:47:23
10:47:24
Resource Management that reports Undersecretary
10:47:27
Kennedy.
10:47:31
Thank you.
10:47:31
And what type interaction occurs
Okay.
between the two IRM offices?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
10:47:32
10:47:35
Foundation and
10:47:36
vague.
You may answer the question.
10:47:37
The POEMS system, far understand
10:47:41 not systems expert was built the
10:47:43
general the State Departments general
10:47:48
information resource management architecture.
10:47:51
10:47:37
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Okay.
And diplomatic security, theres
10:47:53
another division theres division office
10:48:01
called Diplomatic Security.
10:48:03
MR. MYERS: that correct?
Objection.
Beyond the scope authorized discovery.
10:48:05
10:48:06
You may answer the question.
10:48:09
Theres Bureau Diplomatic Security.
10:48:11
And that falls within underneath the
10:48:13
Undersecretary for Management, well?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Beyond the scope authorized discovery.
10:48:18
10:48:19
10:48:21
You may answer the question.
10:48:21
Yes.
10:48:23
Okay.
10:48:23
MR. BEKESHA:
Exhibit
(Deposition Exhibit marked for
identification and attached the transcript.) discussion was held off the record.)
Would you mark this MR. BEKESHA: you want take moment, Mr. Mull,
and review the document.
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10:48:49
10:48:50
10:48:51
10:49:02
10:49:07
10:49:07
10:49:13
10:49:16
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Have you had chance review the
document?
10:50:06
10:50:07
Yes.
10:50:07
Could you just briefly describe what this
10:50:07
document is, what appears be? appears e-mail from someone
named Donald Reid.
Okay.
10:50:10
10:50:15
10:50:19
Have you ever seen this e-mail
before?
10:50:22
10:50:24 dont recall it, no.
10:50:25
Okay. you could look down towards the
10:50:26
bottom the first page, says, S/ES management
10:50:29
does not need respond point for point any
10:50:33
this.
10:50:37
Would S/ES management, would that your
office?
10:50:41
meant.
Okay. seem recall was official the dont know. dont know who they
10:50:43
10:50:45 you know who Donald Reid is?
Diplomatic Security Bureau.
10:50:39
Okay.
Did you ever speak Mr. Reid
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10:50:46
10:50:53
10:50:56
10:50:58
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
about BlackBerry devices for the Office the
10:51:01
Secretary?
10:51:05 dont recall any such conversation.
10:51:06
Okay.
10:51:08
MR. BEKESHA:
10:51:14
10:51:16
(Deposition Exhibit marked for
Lets mark this Exhibit
identification and attached the transcript.)
10:51:16
10:51:33
Have you had chance read the
10:51:33
Yes.
10:52:14 read the record?
10:52:14 fair say this appears
10:52:16
e-mail chain with between Donald Reid and Gentry
10:52:18
Smith about electronic devices the 7th floor?
10:52:24
Yes.
Okay.
10:52:29 you could take look the top
e-mail the chain.
says, Ambassador Boswell would like use
10:52:41
approach and Ambassador Mull about setting this
10:52:44
briefing for seniors and key staff.
10:52:49 you see that?
10:52:51
Yes.
10:52:52 it, the second sentence,
10:52:29
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Okay.
Yes.
10:52:56 you know who is?
10:52:56 have not seen this e-mail before,
10:53:03
Are you Ambassador Mull?
10:52:52 dont know who.
10:53:07
Okay.
10:53:09 ...
10:53:10
Who Ambassador Boswell?
10:53:11
Eric Boswell was the Assistant Secretary
10:53:14
for Diplomatic Security.
Okay.
No.
Okay.
10:53:19 you know who Gentry Smith is?
10:53:23 March 2011, you recall
briefing about electronic devices the 7th floor?
Yes.
Okay.
10:53:20
about?
10:53:23
10:53:32
10:53:37
And what were those briefings
10:53:37
10:53:40
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Its vague.
calls for narrative response.
10:53:40
10:53:42
You may answer the question.
10:53:44 recall set session for that
10:53:48
allowed security people brief our the
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10:53:51
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
executive secretaries Secretariats
10:53:56
information-management clientele security
10:54:02
communications.
10:54:05
Okay.
And you said set up.
Who was
we?
specific individuals within your office that set
10:54:12
the briefings?
10:54:14
The was the action
10:54:10
10:54:16
officer this would have been the security officer
10:54:22
within the Executive Secretariat.
10:54:26
Just generally the office, were there
10:54:06
And who that individual? you recall
who that individual was?
10:54:27
10:54:30
Lou Nardi, his name was.
10:54:37
Was Mrs. Clinton was Mrs. Clinton one
10:54:39 the seniors and key staff that was briefed
10:54:46
these issues?
10:54:49
Briefed this session, recalling,
10:54:55
10:54:58 any session related guess was
there more than one briefing session?
10:54:58
10:55:00 can only recall one session.
10:55:03 you know Mrs. Clinton was part
10:55:05
PLANET DEPOS
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
that briefing session?
10:55:06 dont recall that she was there.
10:55:09 you recall Ms. Abedin was part
10:55:10
that briefing session?
10:55:13 dont recall.
10:55:15 you recall Ms. Mills was part
10:55:16
that briefing session?
10:55:19
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
scope authorized discovery.
Thats beyond the
And the extent
10:55:21
10:55:23
that were wading into cyber security issues, that
10:55:25 specifically exempted from the scope
10:55:28
discovery.
10:55:28
Courts order that regard.
And would ask you observe the
MR. BEKESHA:
10:55:28
Sure.
10:55:31
You may answer the question.
10:55:31 dont recall.
10:55:32
Okay.
10:55:33
Turning now Clintonemail.com.
When did you first become aware
10:55:43
Mrs. Clinton the e-mail address Mrs. Clinton was
10:55:45
using conduct official government business?
10:55:48
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague.
Its
vague, and its ambiguous.
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
You may answer the question.
10:55:57 its difficult question answer
10:56:03
because youre asking when did become aware
10:56:04
she was using private e-mail address for official
10:56:07
government business?
10:56:12
Yes.
10:56:12 dont know that Ive ever really
10:56:17
become aware that.
news articles and the allegations that have been
10:56:22
made that effect.
But you know,
10:56:24
not position judge what whether was
10:56:28
official government business not.
10:56:31
Sure.
10:56:19
Did you ever have did you ever
10:56:33
communicate via e-mail with Mrs. Clinton while you
10:56:36
were Executive Secretary?
10:56:38 certainly aware the
No, not that can recall.
10:56:39
Did you ever communicate with Ms. Abedin
10:56:40
while you were Executive Secretary?
10:56:44
Yes.
10:56:47 you recall what e-mail addresses you
10:56:48
used communicate with Ms. Abedin?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Mischaracterizes
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
prior testimony.
Ms. Abedin.
MR. BEKESHA:
You asked communicated with
10:56:54
10:56:56
Ill rephrase the question.
Did you communicate via e-mail with
Ms. Abedin while you were Executive Secretary?
10:56:58
10:56:59
10:57:01
Yes.
10:57:04 you know what e-mail addresses you used
10:57:04 conduct those communications? cant recall.
10:57:06
Typically would
10:57:13
type her name into the e-mail form, and dont
10:57:15
know what the exact e-mail address was.
10:57:20
Did you know what Mrs. Clintons e-mail
address was while you were Executive Secretary?
No.
MR. BEKESHA:
Exhibit can mark this
identification and attached the transcript.)
MR. BEKESHA:
10:57:38
10:57:40
(Deposition Exhibit marked for
10:57:26
10:57:28 Exhibit
10:57:22
Can you also mark this
Exhibit
10:57:41
10:57:57
10:57:57
10:57:58
(Deposition Exhibit marked for
identification and attached the transcript.)
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10:57:59
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
MR. BEKESHA:
Thank you.
10:58:33 can look Exhibit first.
10:58:33 you recall this e-mail?
10:58:36
10:58:46
Yes.
Okay. you recall seeing sorry.
10:58:46
should have asked, you recall seeing this e-mail
10:58:53 this time, the time was sent?
10:58:55
from the time was sent, no. dont specifically remember from
10:58:58
10:59:01 the line the e-mail, says
10:59:02
10:59:07 you know who is?
10:59:07
Definitively, no.
10:59:10
Okay.
10:59:11
Based the body the e-mail,
does appears though would refer
10:59:14
Mrs. Clinton?
10:59:17
MR. MYERS:
Objection. there
question?
10:59:19
10:59:20
Based after reviewing the entire
10:59:22
e-mail, you think that the refers
10:59:26
Mrs. Clinton?
10:59:28
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Calls for
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
speculation.
10:59:31
You may answer the question.
10:59:31 dont know.
10:59:34
Thats reasonable
assumption, but dont know for fact who
10:59:37
would have received something the e-mail
10:59:40
address.
10:59:45
Lets look Exhibit
10:59:45
You you recall receiving the first
Okay.
e-mail the chain, the bottom e-mail the
10:59:57
chain?
11:00:00
MR. MYERS:
Okay.
Thank you.
11:00:00
No.
11:00:01
Based the line, looks
though you received this e-mail.
least the e-mail was sent you?
Okay.
Correct?
Yes.
10:59:54
11:00:02
11:00:10
11:00:12
11:00:14
Also, this e-mail was sent
HDR22@Clintonemail.com.
11:00:14
11:00:20 you see that?
11:00:24
Yes.
11:00:25 you recall seeing this e-mail address
11:00:25
while you were Executive Secretary?
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Not that can recall.
11:00:33
When you receive e-mails, you usually
11:00:33
look who else receives the e-mails along with
11:00:39
you? you look the the from line, the
11:00:41 line, the line when reviewing e-mails?
11:00:44 depends when when receive it.
11:00:49
The Executive Secretariat was very fast-paced
11:00:52
operation.
11:00:56
line. course, concentrated the from
Sometimes would look who was copied;
sometimes not.
11:00:59
11:01:04
Okay. you know who Harold Koh is?
Yes.
11:01:08
Who Harold Koh?
11:01:08
Well, Harold Koh was the State
11:01:12
Departments legal advisor.
what does now.
legal advisor while was Executive Secretary. cant recall
But was the State Department
Thank you. this e-mail was e-mail
from the State Departments legal advisor. that correct?
MR. MYERS:
speaks for itself.
Objection.
11:01:05
11:01:14
11:01:16
11:01:18
11:01:20
11:01:24
11:01:26
The document
And also object for lack
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
personal knowledge and foundation.
11:01:31
You may answer the question.
11:01:34 appears so, yes.
11:01:35
Okay.
11:01:37
Would e-mail sent the legal
the legal advisor the State Department usually
11:01:41
get lost?
11:01:43
MR. MYERS:
Are those e-mails you would usually read?
Objection.
Vague. calls
for speculation.
11:01:47
11:01:48
You may answer the question.
11:01:51
The question was would lose them
11:01:55
dont understand the question.
11:01:59
Would you read the e-mails?
You said the
11:01:59
Executive Secretariat was fast-paced, you may have
11:02:02
received lot e-mails.
And just want know,
11:02:04 you received e-mail from the legal advisor,
11:02:06
that e-mail that you would tend read?
11:02:09
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague. knew mean, cant exclude what didnt see dont know what didnt see.
But certainly knew that had
11:02:11
11:02:16
11:02:22
11:02:24
received e-mail from the legal advisor, would
11:02:26
make effort read it.
11:02:29
PLANET DEPOS
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Okay.
specific e-mail when came in.
MR. MYERS:
But you dont recall seeing this
Objection.
11:02:31
11:02:33
Asked and
answered.
11:02:36
11:02:37
You may answer the question.
11:02:38
No.
11:02:39
Okay.
And you dont recall seeing
11:02:40
HDR22@Clintonemail.com the e-mail when you
11:02:47
received it?
11:02:49
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Also asked and
answered.
11:02:49
11:02:50 dont recall.
11:02:50
Were there did you ever have any
11:02:50
discussions within the Executive Secretariat about
11:02:55
Mrs. Clintons use e-mail?
11:02:58
None that recall.
11:03:01
Okay.
When you first arrived Executive
11:03:02
Secretariat, did Daniel Smith sorry, Executive
11:03:08
Secretary, did Daniel Smith anyone else discuss
11:03:12
with you Mrs. Clintons use BlackBerry?
11:03:15
Yes.
11:03:25
What were those discussions?
11:03:25
PLANET DEPOS
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
They focused whether not
11:03:32
BlackBerry could used within the Office the
11:03:39
Secretary, the physical space the office
11:03:42
the Secretary.
11:03:44
And the time you started, was
11:03:45
BlackBerry able used within the physical space
11:03:49 the office the Secretary?
11:03:51
The office the Secretary, which was
11:03:54
contiguous mine, the electronic devices were not
11:03:56
permitted there.
11:04:00
Okay. you know Mrs. Clinton was
11:04:03
using State-Department-issued assigned
11:04:07
BlackBerry?
11:04:10 during the time
11:04:14
When you started, was that part the
11:04:15
discussions, the type BlackBerry Mrs. Clinton was
11:04:18
using?
11:04:20
No.
11:04:21
Did you ever during your tenure, did
11:04:21
you ever see Mrs. Clinton use BlackBerry?
11:04:27
Physically, no.
11:04:31
Okay.
11:04:32 you know she, when she used
PLANET DEPOS
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
her BlackBerry, where she would use it, when she was
11:04:37 the State Department?
11:04:40
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Foundation. dont have personal knowledge where
she might have used it.
Did you have any discussions with
11:04:41
11:04:47
11:04:48
11:04:49
individuals when you first started about where
11:04:52
Mrs. Clinton could use her BlackBerry?
11:04:54
Not that recall, no.
11:05:00
Okay.
11:05:01
Did Mrs. Clinton have
State-Department-issued computer her desk?
11:05:02
Not that recall.
11:05:07 you know there was office set
11:05:07
somewhere else for Mrs. Clinton use her
11:05:12
BlackBerry?
11:05:14
11:05:17 have seen reports that the press. dont recall that knew that the time.
Okay.
Mrs. Clinton about her use BlackBerry?
No.
Okay.
Did you ever speak with
Not that can recall, no.
11:05:21
11:05:23
11:05:27
11:05:32
Did you ever speak with Ms. Mills
11:05:35
about use Mrs. Clintons use BlackBerry?
11:05:37
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Not that dont recall speaking with
Ms. Mills about it, no.
11:05:50
Did you communicate with her other ways
about Mrs. Clintons use BlackBerry?
11:05:53
11:05:56 reviewed e-mail that was attributed
11:05:59 the press this, among other subjects.
11:06:02
Yes.
11:05:51 preparing for our meeting today,
11:05:43
Okay.
Besides what, this document that
11:06:06
youre referring to, you recall any other
11:06:10
communications with Ms. Mills about Mrs. Clintons
11:06:12
use BlackBerry?
11:06:14 dont, no.
11:06:17
Okay.
11:06:18
What about communications with
Ms. Abedin about Mrs. Clintons use BlackBerry?
Again, remember the document that saw
11:06:20
11:06:28 the press, which that, among other
11:06:31
subjects, was covered.
11:06:35
Okay. the extent you had any
11:06:36
discussions with anyone else within the State
11:06:40
Department about Mrs. Clintons use BlackBerry,
11:06:42
who were those discussions with?
11:06:45
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague.
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
You may answer the question. cant recall such discussions.
11:06:54
11:06:55
general the subject ever came up, would most
11:06:59
likely speak with the systems experts.
11:07:02
Okay.
And who were those individuals?
11:07:05
The people who worked the Office
11:07:08
S/ES-IRM.
Okay.
Would that have been Mr. Bentel?
MR. MYERS:
11:07:10
Objection.
Asked and
answered.
11:07:13
11:07:17
11:07:18
You may answer the question.
11:07:19
Yes.
11:07:20
Okay.
Among others.
Did you ever talk Clarence
11:07:22
Finney about the use Mrs. about Mrs. Clinton
11:07:25
using BlackBerry?
11:07:27 dont recall.
11:07:28 you recall ever communicating with
11:07:28
Ms. Abedin non-State.gov e-mail account?
11:07:40 cant recall.
11:07:53
Are you aware that Ms. Abedin used
11:07:53
non-State.gov e-mail account conduct official
11:08:00
government business?
11:08:03
PLANET DEPOS
888.433.3767 WWW.PLANETDEPOS.COM
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 aware allegations that effect
11:08:07 the press, but dont have personal
11:08:09
knowledge.
11:08:14
MR. BEKESHA:
(Deposition Exhibit marked for
Mark this Exhibit
identification and attached the transcript.)
11:08:29
11:08:31
11:08:40
Have you had chance review
11:08:40
Yes.
11:09:13
Great. seem recall was staffer
11:09:14
11:09:17
S/ES-IRM.
11:09:20
Mr. Bentel?
11:09:13 you know who Christopher Butzgy is?
Thank you.
Okay.
And would have reported that correct? cant recall who his immediate boss was,
but Mr. Bentel was the director the office.
Okay.
Have you ever seen this e-mail
chain before? seem recall seeing somewhere
the the press.
11:09:22
11:09:25
11:09:30
11:09:32
11:09:34
11:09:37
11:09:42
11:09:45
Okay.
11:09:46 the
11:09:47
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 that would have been within the past
year?
11:09:48
11:09:49 dont know was would have
11:09:53
been cant remember when exactly this came
11:09:55 the press.
11:09:57
But
But after
11:09:59 was definitely the press.
11:10:00
Okay.
11:10:01
But after you were Executive
Secretary after your tenure Executive
11:10:02
Secretary?
11:10:04
Yes.
Did you ever have any conversations with
Yes.
Uh-huh.
11:10:04
11:10:05
Mr. Butzgy about Mrs. Clintons use BlackBerry
11:10:15 e-mail?
11:10:17
No, not that recall.
11:10:18 you recall having any conversations
11:10:20
with Mr. Bentel about Mrs. Clinton difficulty
11:10:24
Mrs. Clinton was having receiving e-mails?
11:10:28 dont recall any such conversation.
11:10:32 you know issues like that were ever
11:10:34
raised during your deputy your daily deputy
11:10:36
meeting?
11:10:42
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 dont recall.
MR. MYERS:
THE WITNESS:
Objection.
11:10:42
Vague. sorry.
11:10:42
11:10:43 Mrs. Clinton the
11:10:45
Mrs. Clinton was having trouble with communications,
11:10:48
would that issue that would raise would
11:10:50
rise your level?
11:10:54
Occasionally the Secretarys
communications issues would come me.
Did any those communication issues come you during your tenure Executive Secretary?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague.
11:10:59
11:11:02
11:11:05
11:11:08
11:11:11
You may answer the question.
11:11:13
Communications general?
11:11:15
Communications general.
11:11:15
Yes.
11:11:17
Okay.
And what were those communications
issues?
11:11:17
11:11:20
Typically the challenges providing
11:11:21
secure telephone communications with the Secretary
11:11:25
while she was away from the State Department.
11:11:27
Okay.
Did ever involve her ability
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
send communicate via e-mail?
11:11:36
11:11:57
Exhibit this could
marked.
11:12:01
(Deposition Exhibit marked for
Not that recall, no.
MR. BEKESHA:
11:11:34
identification and attached the transcript.)
Have you had chance review this
e-mail?
11:12:01
11:12:10
11:12:10
11:12:32
Yes.
11:12:33 this the e-mail that you were
11:12:33
discussing before
MR. MYERS:
11:12:34
Objection.
11:12:36 that you had previous that you had
reviewed preparation for today?
Okay.
11:12:39
Yes.
11:12:36
11:12:41 you recall this e-mail chain?
11:12:41
Besides prior your review, did you recall this
11:12:45
e-mail, you recall this e-mail?
11:12:49
sending the e-mail?
MR. MYERS: you recall
11:12:51
Objection.
Compound.
11:12:52 you recall sending the e-mail?
11:12:54
Well, prior its appearance the press
11:12:56
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
earlier this year, had not recalled it.
Okay.
And you recall what press you
saw about this e-mail? think there was article The
Okay.
11:13:03
11:13:06
Washington Post earlier this year.
11:12:59
11:13:13
11:13:16
When you read the article, that
11:13:17
helped what did you think when you read the
11:13:23
article about this e-mail?
11:13:26
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague, and calls
for narrative response.
11:13:27
11:13:29
You may answer the question.
11:13:30
What did think?
11:13:33
what thought. thought was interesting.
11:13:36
Why did you think was interesting?
11:13:39
MR. MYERS: dont recall
11:13:41
Objection.
Vague, and calls
for narrative response.
You may answer the question.
11:13:44
MR. MYERS:
11:13:48
authorized discovery, well.
11:13:43
And beyond the scope
11:13:49
You may answer the question.
11:13:50
Well, think whenever something
11:13:51
appears The Washington Post with your name it,
PLANET DEPOS
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11:13:55
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 its nature interesting.
Did you think was good thing?
Did
11:13:59
you like seeing your name The Washington Post?
11:14:03
MR. MYERS:
11:13:58
Objection.
Beyond the scope authorized discovery.
11:14:06
11:14:07
Usually not.
11:14:08
Did you talk anybody outside your
11:14:09
counsel preparation for today, have you talked
11:14:11
anybody about this e-mail?
11:14:15
MR. MYERS:
Objection. just want
11:14:17
observe the courts order that scopes out number
11:14:18 topics.
11:14:20 exclude the other things that are excluded the
11:14:22
courts order.
11:14:24 you could rephrase your question
Excluding counsel, well any law
11:14:25
enforcement that currently have active
11:14:28
law-enforcement proceedings going on, did you speak
11:14:31 anyone about this e-mail?
11:14:36
Yes.
11:14:41
Who did you speak with?
11:14:41 spoke with the Inspector Generals
11:14:47
office the State Department. spoke with
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
individuals the Office the Legal Advisor. suppose colleagues mine may have mentioned
11:15:06
me, Hey, saw your name The Washington Post.
11:15:09 you recall who those colleagues were?
11:15:13
11:15:15
Objection.
11:15:16
No, not today cant.
Okay.
Beyond the scope authorized discovery.
11:14:57
MR. MYERS:
And
No.
And you mentioned you spoke with
the Office Legal Advisor.
Was that
preparation was that preparation for today?
11:15:18
11:15:20
11:15:24
11:15:25
No.
11:15:28
Okay.
11:15:29
Well, have spoken with someone
11:15:29
preparation for today.
discussion was not did not know this would
11:15:36 happening.
11:15:39
MR. MYERS:
But the first time had the going preemptively
11:15:33
11:15:40
instruct the witness not reveal the content
11:15:42
conversations with legal advisor any context.
11:15:44 hope can agree that.
11:15:47
MR. BEKESHA:
Sure.
11:15:48
MR. MYERS:
Thank you.
11:15:49
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 looking the e-mail itself, the
11:15:49
bottom e-mail, the bottom e-mail the chain,
11:15:55
appears e-mail from you Ms. Mills.
11:15:59 that correct?
11:16:03
Yes.
11:16:04
Also the e-mail Ms. Abedin, Patrick
11:16:06
Kennedy, and Monica Hanley. that correct?
11:16:09
Yes.
11:16:12 you know you bccd anyone this
11:16:12
e-mail?
11:16:16 dont recall.
11:16:17
Who who that time who was
11:16:17
Ms. Abedin?
11:16:23
11:16:25
Ms. Abedin was the deputy chief staff Secretary Clinton for operations.
Management.
Yes.
Okay.
And Mr. Kennedy was the Undersecretary for that correct?
11:16:29
11:16:31
11:16:35
11:16:37
And you know who Monica Hanley
is?
11:16:37
11:16:40
Monica Hanley was that time the employee the Office the Secretary.
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11:16:48
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 you know what her specific title was?
11:16:49 dont remember.
11:16:53 you know what her basic general
11:16:53
responsibilities were?
11:16:56
She generally provided immediate support
11:16:58 Secretary Clinton traveling, carrying her
11:17:01
briefing books, providing, you know, immediate
11:17:07
personal support the Secretary.
11:17:11
Looking the e-mail, starts
11:17:13
off, Cheryl, thanks again for alerting the
11:17:19
communication issues the Secretary has been having.
11:17:23
Okay.
Those communication issues, was that what
11:17:26
you were discussing, talked about before, about
11:17:28
secure telephone calls?
11:17:33 dont recall the circumstances that
resulted this e-mail.
with Cheryl Mills about secure communications
11:17:42
difficulties.
11:17:46
Okay.
But very often did speak
11:17:36
Turning the page and looking the starts off,
11:17:39
11:17:48
second-to-last paragraph.
Separately, are working provide the Secretary
11:18:02
per her request department-issued BlackBerry
11:18:04
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
replace her unit, which malfunctioning. you see that?
11:18:10
Yes.
11:18:11
MR. MYERS:
Objection. think you
misread the text just little bit.
MR. BEKESHA:
MR. MYERS: dont know
MR. BEKESHA:
MR. MYERS:
11:18:16
11:18:18 can agree that the document
speaks for itself. sorry.
11:18:12
11:18:13
what apologize.
11:18:08
11:18:21
11:18:23
Yes. can move on.
Yeah. you recall, prior this e-mail you
11:18:24
11:18:26
11:18:27
recall having any communications with Ms. Mills
11:18:30
about issuing the department issuing BlackBerry
11:18:33 Mrs. Clinton?
11:18:36 dont recall, no.
11:18:39 you recall having any conversations
11:18:40
with anyone the State Department prior this
11:18:42
e-mail about issuing Mrs. Clinton BlackBerry?
11:18:46 dont recall, no.
11:18:50
Okay.
11:18:51 you dont recall why you wrote
this sentence?
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Today dont, no.
11:18:56
Okay.
11:18:57 you know who you would have
spoken with about issuing Mrs. Clinton BlackBerry?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Foundation.
11:19:00
11:19:05
You may answer the question.
11:19:07
Typically ever received request
11:19:09
from any our senior clientele, including the
11:19:12
Secretary, systems-related,
11:19:15
communications-related support, would typically
11:19:20
refer those questions our systems support staff.
11:19:22
And who would the contact there?
Who would you specifically refer to?
MR. MYERS:
Okay.
Objection.
11:19:28
Compound.
11:19:30
Who who would you specifically refer
such issue to?
MR. MYERS:
11:19:25
11:19:32
11:19:35
Objection.
Foundation.
11:19:36
You may answer the question.
11:19:38 the systems support staff who
11:19:40
individually depended the case.
could anybody who worked that office who
11:19:50
happened see.
11:19:52
Was there one person within that staff
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
that was responsible for issuing BlackBerrys the
11:19:54
office the Secretary?
11:19:57 had there was office, was
11:20:07
called think was called mobile solutions,
11:20:08
that provided BlackBerry support our full range
11:20:12 clientele the Executive Secretariat.
11:20:17
Okay. you know how someone within the
11:20:19
Office the Secretary would receive would
11:20:23
issued BlackBerry from the State Department?
11:20:27
They would make the request the mobile
solutions office.
11:20:32
11:20:35
Did any was during your time
11:20:37
Executive Secretary, were there any new hires within
11:20:40
the Office the Secretary?
11:20:44 cant cant recall.
11:20:51
Okay. you you know, there was
11:20:52 new hire, that individual would have request
11:20:54 BlackBerry the BlackBerry would have just
11:20:58
been issued their first day?
11:21:00 cant say. you know who was responsible for dont know.
issuing e-mail addresses employees within the
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11:21:12
11:21:15
Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Office the Secretary?
No.
Okay.
11:21:17
11:21:23 you know what that you
11:21:23
know what the process was for issuing e-mail
11:21:24
address employees within the Office the
11:21:25
Secretary?
11:21:27 no. generally speaking,
11:21:34
when you start office, you fill out form
11:21:37
that acted upon granting e-mail address.
11:21:44
But not sure who approves who comes
11:21:49
with the address.
11:21:50
Okay. you know the Secretary
State would required fill out that form?
11:21:51
11:21:55 dont know.
11:21:59
Either her either the Secretary
11:22:00
personally somebody her behalf.
11:22:01 dont know.
11:22:04
Looking back the e-mail, you continue,
11:22:04
Possibly because her personal e-mail server
11:22:16
down.
11:22:20 you see that?
11:22:21
Yes.
11:22:22
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 you recall having any conversations
11:22:22
with anybody within the State Department about
11:22:26
Mrs. Clintons personal e-mail server being down?
11:22:29 dont recall conversations.
11:22:33 this point fair say that you
11:22:34
knew that Mrs. Clinton was using personal e-mail
11:22:39
server?
11:22:42
Yes, suppose you could say that, uh-huh.
11:22:48 you know how you learned that?
11:22:51 cant recall, no.
11:22:56 you recall when you learned that?
11:22:58
No.
11:23:01
Okay. cant recall. you recall any conversations
about Mrs. Clintons personal e-mail server?
11:23:01
11:23:05
During time Executive Secretary?
11:23:13
During your time Executive Secretary.
11:23:15
Yes.
Sorry about that.
11:23:17
No, cant cant recall, no.
11:23:20
Were going continue with the e-mail.
11:23:22
You next say, will prepare two versions for her
11:23:25 use, one with operating State Department
11:23:28
e-mail account.
11:23:32
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 you see that?
11:23:34
11:23:35
Yes.
Uh-huh.
What you mean prepare two
versions?
11:23:37
11:23:39
Well, again, cant recall the exact
11:23:46
circumstances that led write this e-mail.
11:23:49
Reading now, understand mean that there
11:23:55
would two version two different kinds
11:23:58
BlackBerry, one with e-mail support and one without.
11:24:03
Okay.
When you were the when you
11:24:05
were Executive Secretary, did you have two
11:24:12
State-Department-issued BlackBerrys?
11:24:14
Did have?
11:24:19
Did you, yes.
11:24:20 cant recall, no. you know employees within the Office
No.
11:24:23
11:24:25 the Secretary had two State-Department-issued
11:24:27
BlackBerrys, one for access e-mail account,
11:24:30
and another one phone and Internet capability?
11:24:35 dont know.
11:24:41 you recall this would have been
11:24:42
unusual request?
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague.
11:24:46
You may answer the question.
11:24:48
What what you mean the term
11:24:52
request?
Who whose request?
11:24:53
Would this have been the State
11:24:55
Department preparing two versions BlackBerry
11:24:58
for Mrs. Clinton, would that preparation two
11:24:59
BlackBerrys unusual?
11:25:02
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague.
You may answer the question. just dont recall.
11:25:04
11:25:07
11:25:11
typically was not involved issuing BlackBerrys
11:25:13
employees.
11:25:16 you know why there why she
required two versions the BlackBerry?
MR. MYERS:
Okay.
Objection.
Mischaracterizes
prior testimony.
11:25:17
11:25:21
11:25:24
11:25:25
You may answer the question.
11:25:27 dont know that she required two.
11:25:29
Okay.
11:25:30 you recall why you suggested you
would prepare two versions the BlackBerry? dont recall why, no.
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Why were you why were you involved with
the discussions this time?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
11:25:48
Foundation.
Again, cant remember the circumstances
that led write this e-mail today. suppose can infer came
11:25:41
11:25:50
11:25:53
11:25:56
11:26:02
attention that the Secretary was interested
11:26:04
acquiring e-mail interested acquiring
11:26:08
BlackBerry.
11:26:11
11:26:12 you recall Mrs. Clinton was
interested acquiring e-mail account that
11:26:15
time?
11:26:18 dont recall that, no.
11:26:20
Okay.
11:26:21
Looking further the e-mail,
says, one with operating State Department e-mail
11:26:26
account, and then parentheses, which would mask
11:26:28
her identity, but which would also subject
11:26:31
FOIA requests.
11:26:35 you see that?
11:26:35
11:26:36
Yes.
Okay.
Uh-huh.
Lets take the first part, the
masking her identity.
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Why would she need her e-mail address
masked?
11:26:46
MR. MYERS:
11:26:42
Objection.
Mischaracterizes
prior testimony.
11:26:46
11:26:48
You may answer the question.
11:26:48
Well, dont know that she needed
11:26:55
masked.
speculation this speculation part.
typically probably would not, Executive
11:27:15
Secretariat, support establishing e-mail address
11:27:21
that was commonly available every employee the
11:27:26
State Department.
11:27:29
Typically the again, this
Okay.
11:27:00
But that the reason why you
11:27:13
11:27:30
proposed why you commented that would mask
11:27:35
her identity?
11:27:37
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Foundation.
11:27:38
You may answer the question.
11:27:39
Again, cant recall the
11:27:41
circumstances that led write this.
But
11:27:45
speculate would have been ensure that was
11:27:49
clear that Secretary Clintons name would not appear
11:27:53 the State Departments directory.
11:27:57
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Okay. Mrs. Clintons name did not
11:27:59
appear the directory, how would employees
11:28:04
communicate with her?
11:28:08
e-mail address?
11:28:11
MR. MYERS:
How would employees know her
Objection.
Foundation.
Calls
for speculation.
11:28:12
11:28:13
You may answer the question.
11:28:14 dont know.
11:28:18
Okay.
11:28:20
The next part the e-mail says,
but which would also subject FOIA requests. that correct?
11:28:23
11:28:27 says that, yes. you recall why you wrote that?
11:28:30
MR. MYERS:
11:28:33
Uh-huh.
Objection.
Asked and
answered.
11:28:29
11:28:34
Yeah, again, dont recall the
11:28:35
circumstances that led write that.
11:28:38
Prior writing this e-mail, did you have
11:28:41
any communications with anyone the State
11:28:44
Department about FOIA Mrs. Clintons e-mail and
11:28:47
FOIA requests?
11:28:51
Not that recall, no.
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Did you have any did you have any
11:28:55
conversations with anyone which you the other
11:28:59
individual raised concern that Mrs. Clintons
11:29:04
e-mail was currently not being subject FOIA
11:29:06
requests?
11:29:09
No, dont recall any conversation like
that.
11:29:13
11:29:15 you recall ever hearing that there were
11:29:15
concerns that Mrs. Clintons e-mails were not being
11:29:19
subject FOIA requests?
11:29:22
No, dont.
Going back the first page.
11:29:26
The e-mail
11:29:27
above the one were just discussing response
11:29:38
from Ms. Abedin you.
11:29:42
lets discuss the State BlackBerry.
whole lot sense.
And starts off, Steve,
Doesnt make
11:29:50 you see that?
11:29:51
11:29:52
Yes.
Okay.
11:29:46 you recall receiving that e-mail
from Ms. Abedin?
11:29:52
11:29:54
No.
11:29:56 you recall ever discussing with
11:29:56
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Ms. Abedin the e-mail and State Department
11:29:59
BlackBerry after the receipt this e-mail?
11:30:03
No.
11:30:05 you know you had any conversation
11:30:06
with Ms. Abedin after this e-mail?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
11:30:10
Asked and
answered.
11:30:12
11:30:15
You can answer the question.
11:30:15
Did have any conversations with her?
11:30:16
Any conversations about State Department
11:30:18
BlackBerry, sorry.
11:30:20
Not that recall, no.
11:30:21
Okay.
11:30:21
The e-mail from that appears response from you Ms. Abedin.
11:30:26 that correct?
11:30:30
Yes.
11:30:31 says, Thanks for reminding all
11:30:31
Thanks for reminding all this very helpful
11:30:35
context, three exclamation marks maybe yes, and
11:30:40 smiley face.
11:30:44
Yes.
11:30:45 that correct?
11:30:45
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Yes.
11:30:46 you recall you had conversation
11:30:46
before sending that e-mail?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
11:30:48
Vague. you recall having conversation about
11:30:52
11:30:55
contact providing where Ms. Abedin provided
11:30:59
you with helpful context?
11:31:02
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague.
11:31:04
No, dont recall.
11:31:06 you recall why you sent this response?
11:31:07 dont recall why, no.
11:31:11
The the e-mail above that appears
11:31:12 response from Ms. Abedin you.
Ms. Abedin
states, Its pretty silly and she knows it.
11:31:19
11:31:23 you know what that was reference to?
11:31:27
MR. MYERS:
11:31:29
Objection.
Vague.
You may answer the question.
11:31:31
Well, again, dont recall receiving
11:31:35
this e-mail the time. looking now,
would understand talking about the concerns
11:31:43
about the equipment installed for while she was
11:31:45
traveling.
11:31:49
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Besides have you spoken with Ms. Abedin
11:31:51
about this e-mail chain since you learned
11:31:55
the media?
11:32:00
No.
11:32:01
Have you talked about this e-mail chain
11:32:01
with Mr. Kennedy since you read about the
11:32:04
media?
11:32:06
No.
11:32:07
Have you talked about this e-mail with
11:32:07
Ms. Mills since you read about the media?
No.
And then last, Ms. Hanley.
11:32:11
11:32:14
Have you
11:32:14
talked her about this e-mail chain since you read
11:32:17 the media?
11:32:19
No.
11:32:20
Did you speak with the Inspector General
11:32:21
about this e-mail within the past year? dont recall. meetings with the
11:32:28
11:32:45
Inspector General, one was telephone conversation
11:32:48
last summer, and then there was meeting
11:32:53
office September, before this was the media.
11:32:56 dont recall that, that discussed this.
11:33:00
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Have you spoken the Inspector General
since this was the media?
11:33:08
11:33:11
MR. MYERS:
line questioning.
specifically protects protects the
11:33:15
confidentiality the investigation and the
11:33:19
communications that the has.
11:33:21
questions about the substance what knows, you
11:33:23
should ask those questions.
11:33:25
MR. BEKESHA: going object this
11:33:12
There statute that
11:33:13 you have
Sure.
11:33:27 you know who Bryan Pagliano is?
11:33:30 have read his name the media
11:33:39
recently, yes.
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Thats ambiguous.
Which part are you asking about, the while?
MR. BEKESHA:
Did you know who Bryan Pagliano was
while you were Executive Secretary?
Okay.
11:33:43
About Mr. Pagliano.
Did you know who Mr. Pagliano was while
you were Executive Secretary?
11:33:43
11:33:47
11:33:49
11:33:52
11:33:55
11:33:56
11:33:59 dont recall that did, no.
11:34:01 you recall ever speaking with
11:34:02
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
Mr. Pagliano while you were Executive Secretary?
11:34:06
No.
11:34:08
Have you spoken anyone besides counsel
11:34:08
and any law enforcement where theres active
11:34:14
investigation going about Mr. Pagliano?
11:34:17
Have you spoken anyone else?
11:34:20 seem recall have.
11:34:25
Again, when his
name appeared the media, vaguely remember
11:34:29
people asking knew who was.
11:34:33
Who were those individuals?
Were any
them the State Department?
Some may have been.
specific conversations.
11:34:38
11:34:41 cant remember
But friends, colleagues. you recall generally what you told them
when they asked?
11:34:46
11:34:47
11:34:51
11:34:54
That did not know him.
11:34:56 you know any other State you
11:34:58
know any State Department officials employees
11:35:03
that used e-mail account Clintonemail.com
11:35:06
conduct official government business?
11:35:10
Well, your question based the
assumption that knew that someone was conducting
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
government business, and dont have basis
11:35:22 make such judgment.
11:35:24 you know any State Department
11:35:25
monies, resources, personnel were used create
11:35:30 operate Clintonemail.com?
11:35:35 dont know.
11:35:37 you know Mrs. Clinton any point
11:35:38
was advised not was advised use State.gov
11:35:42
e-mail account conduct official government
11:35:47
business?
11:35:48 not aware that she was.
11:35:49 you know Ms. Abedin was ever advised
11:35:50 use State.gov e-mail account conduct
11:35:55
official government business?
11:35:58
No, not aware that.
11:36:01
Okay. you know anybody authorized
11:36:03
Mrs. Clinton use non-State.gov e-mail account
11:36:06 conduct official government business?
11:36:10 dont know.
11:36:12 you know Mrs. Clintons use
11:36:12
Clinton e-mail dot non-State Department e-mail
11:36:17
address was conflict with State Departments
11:36:21
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
policies, practices, procedures?
MR. MYERS:
Objection the extent that calls for legal conclusion.
11:36:23
11:36:25
11:36:26
You may answer the question.
11:36:27 dont know the law it.
11:36:29 you know memorandum exists that
11:36:31
talks about Mrs. Clintons use non-State.gov
11:36:35
e-mail account?
11:36:39 know sorry, could you repeat
that question?
11:36:41
11:36:44
That memorandum exists that discusses
11:36:44
Mrs. Clintons use non-State.gov e-mail
11:36:46
account.
11:36:50 vaguely aware. think there was
11:36:58
some reference that the the press
11:37:00
accounts this issue.
11:37:03
Okay.
MR. BEKESHA:
11:37:05
Lets take five-minute
ten-minute break.
VIDEO SPECIALIST:
11:37:10
11:37:12
This marks the end
11:37:13
Tape Number the deposition Stephen Mull.
11:37:16 are off the record 11:37.
11:37:20
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 recess was taken.)
11:37:50
VIDEO SPECIALIST:
11:53:18
Here begins Tape Number the deposition Stephen Mull. are back the record 11:53.
11:53:25
11:53:28
MR. BEKESHA:
Were going mark this Exhibit
11:53:32
(Deposition Exhibit marked for
11:53:34
Thank you.
identification and attached the transcript.)
MR. BEKESHA:
Great.
Thank you.
Have you had chance look the
record?
11:53:34
11:54:22
11:54:22
11:54:23
Ive Ive looked but, obviously,
not read the whole thing, ...
11:53:31
Okay.
Have you this the January
11:54:25
11:54:26
11:54:28
2016 OIG report entitled Evaluation the
11:54:31
Department States FOIA processes for requests
11:54:36
involving the Office the Secretary.
11:54:40
Have you seen this before?
11:54:42
Yes.
11:54:44
When did you see this?
11:54:44
When was released earlier this year.
11:54:47
Okay.
11:54:49
Have you discussed this report with
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
anyone, excluding counsel and any law-enforcement
11:54:52
officers that are currently engaging active
11:54:57
law-enforcement investigation?
11:55:01
Not that recall, no.
11:55:03
Okay.
11:55:04
Did you speak with the Office
Inspector General with respect this report?
11:55:10
Not that recall, no.
11:55:16
Okay.
11:55:17 going point your attention couple the pages.
11:55:21
All right.
11:55:26
Lets first Page
11:55:26
And either you want take moment
11:55:28
look now, can ask the question and then
11:55:33
you can have opportunity look the page.
11:55:36
Whatever works best for you, Mr. Mull.
11:55:38
Okay.
The the entire page?
11:55:40
Yeah. mean, you can take look.
11:55:42
Okay.
Ive read it.
11:56:50
Thank you.
Does this page properly
11:56:51
reflect what you recall the FOIA process for
11:56:53
requests involving the Office the Secretary while
11:56:57
you were Executive Secretary?
11:56:58
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016
MR. MYERS:
MS. BERMAN:
MR. BEKESHA:
Five.
THE WITNESS:
Oh, was six.
sorry. sorry.
Objection.
Okay.
Great.
Sorry.
What page were you on?
11:57:08
11:57:13
11:57:15
Not problem.
Yes.
11:57:20
11:58:57
Thank you.
11:58:57
Does this Ill ask question again.
11:57:00
11:57:10 mistake.
MR. BEKESHA:
Vague.
11:58:58
Does this properly reflect what you recall the
11:59:00
FOIA process for requests involving the Office
11:59:02
the Secretary while you were Executive Secretary?
11:59:05
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague.
11:59:07
You may answer the question.
11:59:09 far recall.
11:59:11 dont
recall the very specific process, but this seems
11:59:13
consistent with what recall.
11:59:18 refers FOIA FOIA
analyst.
while you were Executive Secretary?
11:59:19
11:59:23 you recall who the FOIA analyst was
Okay. dont, no.
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Okay. also discusses Deputy Director Correspondence, Records and Staffing.
recall who that individual was while you were
11:59:36
Executive Secretary?
11:59:38 dont recall, no.
Moving Page you
11:59:29
11:59:34
11:59:43
The paragraph that
11:59:50
starts Page and ends Page want
11:59:57
direct your attention to.
12:00:01
Okay.
12:00:02
Ill give you minute read that over.
12:00:02
MR. MYERS:
12:00:05
Michael, this the paragraph
that starts, addition?
MR. BEKESHA:
MR. MYERS:
Okay.
Yes.
12:00:08
Thanks.
12:00:08
Okay.
12:00:06
12:01:01 that paragraph reads, S/ES
12:01:01
rarely searched electronic e-mail accounts prior
12:01:05
2011 and still does not consistently search these
12:01:08
accounts even when relevant records are likely
12:01:11
uncovered through such search.
12:01:14 you see that?
12:01:17
Yes.
12:01:17
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 you recall whether not while you
12:01:18
were Executive Secretary the Executive Secretariat
12:01:23
searched electronic e-mail accounts?
12:01:27
MR. MYERS: the extent that your
12:01:29
question goes beyond former Secretary Clinton and
12:01:30
Huma Abedin, object that its beyond the scope
12:01:33
discovery.
12:01:35
You may answer the question.
12:01:36 typically Executive Secretary was not
12:01:37
personally involved conducting searches,
12:01:41
cant cant recall.
12:01:45
Okay.
12:01:47 when was when wasnt done.
12:01:48
Sure.
12:01:49
Okay.
Thank you.
The last sentence says, The FOIA analyst
12:01:52
described the decision search e-mail accounts
12:01:55 discretionary, one that only exercised
12:01:58
periodically.
12:02:00 you see that?
12:02:01
Yes.
12:02:05
While you were Executive Secretary, did
12:02:06
you have any conversations with anyone within the
12:02:07
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Office Executive Secretariat about whether not
12:02:09
e-mail accounts should searched regularly?
12:02:12
MR. MYERS:
Again.
Same objection, the
12:02:15
extent your question isnt limited the
12:02:17
individuals identified the courts order setting
12:02:20
the scope permissible discovery.
12:02:22
You may answer the question.
12:02:23 dont recall any such
12:02:25
conversations.
12:02:26
Are you surprised with these findings
the Inspector General?
12:02:26
12:02:29
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Its beyond the
scope permissible discovery.
12:02:31
12:02:34
You may answer the question.
12:02:35 surprised with all the findings
12:02:37
12:02:39
With the findings specifically, those two
sentences that were just discussing.
MR. MYERS:
Same objection.
12:02:39
12:02:42
12:02:43
You may answer the question.
12:02:44 sorry.
12:02:49
Just one the last
sentence that paragraph?
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Yes.
The S/ES rarely searched electronic
12:02:53
e-mail accounts prior 2011, and then the
12:02:55
sentence, The FOIA analyst described the decision
12:02:58 search.
12:03:00
MR. MYERS:
Same objection
scope discovery, and also foundation. dont have basis surprised
not surprised.
12:03:01
12:03:04
12:03:08
12:03:12 you know why the change was made
12:03:14
2011 about how electronic e-mail accounts were
12:03:22
searched subject FOIA requests?
12:03:26
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague.
Assumes
facts not evidence.
12:03:27
12:03:29
You may answer the question.
12:03:30
Which change 2011?
12:03:31
The talks about, the report says,
12:03:32
S/ES rarely searched electronic e-mail accounts
12:03:37
prior 2011.
12:03:39
Oh.
12:03:41 our question is, you know why
12:03:41
what changed why changed between
Yeah.
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
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MR. MYERS:
Same objection.
12:03:47
And your
question also now compound.
12:03:49
12:03:50
You may answer the question.
12:03:51 dont know why, no.
12:03:52 you could turn Page 11.
12:03:54
Specifically the paragraph of, Lack written
12:04:05
policies and procedures.
12:04:10
Okay.
12:04:13
Okay.
12:04:56
Great.
The first sentence, Although
12:04:57
other department components, such the Bureaus
12:05:00
Diplomatic Security and International Narcotics and
12:05:04
Law Enforcement Affairs, have their own written FOIA
12:05:07
guidance standard operating procedures, S/ES does
12:05:10
not.
12:05:14 you see that sentence?
12:05:14
Yes.
12:05:15
Does that help refresh your recollection
12:05:16 whether not S/ES had specific written FOIA
12:05:17
guidance when you were Executive Secretary?
12:05:22 dont remember any any such guidance.
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 there were such guidance, who would
responsible for writing such guidance?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
12:05:30
Foundation.
Calls
for speculation.
12:05:28
12:05:32
12:05:33
Well, again, dont know.
But
12:05:39
would speculate that the office responsible for that
12:05:41
function, the office then the Office
12:05:45
Correspondence and Records.
12:05:50
Okay.
Turning Page 13, the paragraph
entitled, Insufficient Training.
12:05:50
12:05:58
Yes.
12:06:30 just had quick question of, you
12:06:30
recall training occurring within the Office the
12:06:34
Executive Secretariat while you were Executive
12:06:37
Secretary?
12:06:39
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Vague, and goes
beyond the scope authorized discovery.
12:06:39
12:06:41
You may answer the question.
12:06:43 not recall such training.
12:06:45
Turning Page 14.
12:06:51
Actually, strike that.
Lets turn Page
20.
12:07:04
12:07:13
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Conducted June 2016 you could take look Page 20,
well
12:07:24
Okay. that would great.
Okay.
Great.
12:07:26
Thank you.
12:07:26
12:09:25
Thank you.
12:09:25
This appears letter from MaryKary
Carlson the Inspector General?
Yes.
And MaryKary Carlson the time was the
Uh-huh.
12:09:34
Acting Executive Secretary?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Foundation.
12:09:41 dont know that fact, but thats
the investigation?
Okay.
12:09:49
12:09:51
No.
12:09:43
12:09:47
Did you ever speak with Ms. Carlson about
12:09:35
12:09:38
what says the ...
12:09:27
12:09:30
12:07:22
12:09:53
Looking Recommendation
12:09:53
states, The Executive Secretariat further agrees
12:09:59
with the OIG recommendation that S/ES employees
12:10:02
should reminded that federal records contained
12:10:05
personal e-mails may subject FOIA and should
12:10:08
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
Conducted June 2016 preserved the departments record-keeping
12:10:11
systems.
12:10:14
guidance and instruction from the Undersecretary for
12:10:19
Management October 17, 2014.
12:10:22
All department employees received this you know any instructions were
12:10:25
provided S/ES employees prior October 17th,
12:10:27
2014?
12:10:32
MR. MYERS:
Objection. goes beyond the
scope authorized discovery.
12:10:33
12:10:35
You may answer the question.
12:10:36 dont dont recall any, no.
12:10:38
There also, farther down that
12:10:39
paragraph states, All employees are required
12:10:44
copy forward any personal message containing
12:10:48
federal record their official department e-mail
12:10:51
accounts for appropriate retention and archiving.
12:10:54
While you were Executive Secretary, you
12:10:58
know any such guidance any such guidance
12:11:00
was provided that effect employees within the
12:11:06
office the Secretary?
12:11:09
MR. MYERS:
Objection. goes beyond the
scope authorized discovery, which concerns FOIA
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Videotaped Deposition Stephen Mull
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processing, not records management general
12:11:14
matter.
12:11:16
MR. BEKESHA:
Sure.
12:11:17
You may answer the question.
12:11:17 dont recall any.
12:11:18
Okay.
(Deposition Exhibit marked for
identification and attached the transcript.)
MR. MYERS:
Were going move what were going mark Exhibit
Lets move on.
Now have color copy
this.
12:11:19
12:11:24
12:11:27
12:11:54
12:11:54
12:11:56
Have you seen this report before?
12:12:09
Ive seen mention the press
12:12:17
recently.
12:12:19
Okay.
But you havent read the report? have not, no.
12:12:22
Okay.
12:12:23
And think you answered this
12:12:20
before, but did you speak with the Office
12:12:26
Inspector General with respect this report?
12:12:30
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
The
12:12:32
investigation not relevant the scope
12:12:37
discovery.
12:12:39 you have substantive questions, you
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100
should ask him.
12:12:41
MR. BEKESHA:
Sure.
12:12:41
You may answer the question.
12:12:42 spoke with the Office the Inspector
12:12:46
General two occasions last summer.
recall that they was about the general
12:12:58
question e-mail practices. dont specifically
12:13:01
remember that they that they said was for the
12:13:10
title this inspection.
12:13:11
Okay. cant
Thank you.
12:13:13 could turn Page Footnote
12:12:50
12:13:15
The report states, individual based New York
12:13:29
who provided technical support for Secretary
12:13:33
Clintons personal e-mail system but who was never
12:13:36
employed the department.
12:13:40 you know who that individual is?
12:13:41
MR. MYERS:
12:13:42
scope authorized discovery.
Objection. goes beyond the
12:13:44
You may answer the question.
12:13:46
No, dont.
12:13:47 Page Footnote 14. talks about
12:13:48 states, March 17, 2009, memorandum prepared
12:14:12
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Conducted June 2016
101
S/ES-IRM staff regarding communications equipment
12:14:16
the Secretarys New York residence identified
12:14:22
server located the basement.
12:14:26 you see that?
12:14:27
12:14:28
Yes.
When you became Executive Secretary, were
Uh-huh.
you shown this memorandum?
12:14:29
12:14:32
No, not that recall.
12:14:34
Have you ever seen the memorandum
12:14:41
identified this footnote?
No, dont remember ever seeing
memorandum like that.
Have you ever discussed with anybody
12:14:42
12:14:43
12:14:46
12:14:46
within the office the Executive Secretariat this
12:14:48
memorandum the memorandum identified this
12:14:51
footnote?
12:14:54
No, not that recall.
12:14:55
Moving Page
12:14:56 interested the first paragraph that
12:15:10
starts, 2009.
paragraph for moment, please. you could take look that
Okay.
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102
Great. you know what the SMART system
is?
12:15:44
12:15:42 know information processing
12:15:45
system within the department, but not completely
12:15:53
familiar with the details.
12:15:55
Okay.
The report states, 2009 IRM
12:15:56
introduced SMART throughout the department, enabling
12:16:02
employees preserve record copy e-mails
12:16:05
through their department e-mail accounts without
12:16:07
having print and file them.
12:16:09 IRM you know IRM that
12:16:11
instance was the general IRM for the State
12:16:14
Department the specific S/ES-IRM?
12:16:18
MR. MYERS: going object.
beyond the scope discovery.
records management and preservations, not FOIA
12:16:27
processing.
12:16:28
MR. BEKESHA:
This
This concerns
Sure.
12:16:20
12:16:23
12:16:29
You may answer the question.
12:16:29 dont know.
12:16:31
But assuming from the
context that this would the departments overall
12:16:34
IRM.
12:16:37
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103
Okay.
Thank you.
12:16:38
The next sentence is, However, the Office
12:16:39 the Secretary elected not use SMART
12:16:41
preserve e-mails.
12:16:44 question is, were you did you have
12:16:47
any conversations with anyone within the Office
12:16:50
the Secretary about electing not use SMART
12:16:53
preserve e-mails?
12:16:55
MR. MYERS:
Same objection scope.
12:16:56
You may answer the question.
12:16:59 dont recall any such conversations with
12:17:01
the Office the Secretary.
Okay.
12:17:04 you recall any conversations
12:17:05
with anyone within the State Department about the
12:17:07
Office the Secretary electing not use SMART
12:17:09
preserve e-mails?
12:17:13
MR. MYERS:
Same objection scope.
No, dont remember.
Moving Page 11.
12:17:16
The paragraph that
starts, Since 2004.
Okay.
Great.
12:17:13
12:17:17
12:17:35
12:18:20 it, that paragraph,
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104
states there August 2004 memorandum from the
12:18:23
Executive Secretary that reminded departing
12:18:27
officials not remove any document documentary
12:18:30
materials, whether personal official, and whether
12:18:34 written electronic form, until such materials
12:18:36
have been reviewed records and security officers.
12:18:41 question is, have you seen that August
2004 memorandum?
12:18:43
12:18:45
MR. MYERS:
This exceeds
12:18:46
the scope discovery authorized the courts
12:18:47
order.
12:18:50
MR. BEKESHA:
Same objection.
Sure.
12:18:50
You may answer the question.
12:18:51 sitting here today, dont recall
12:18:53
that memorandum.
Okay.
12:18:55
Farther down the paragraph
12:18:55
says the department reiterated this guidance
12:18:58
April, June, and October 2008.
12:19:00
Did you see any memorandum that may have
12:19:04
been issued April, June, October 2008 about
12:19:08
this issue?
12:19:11
MR. MYERS:
Same objection.
And the
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question compound.
MR. BEKESHA:
12:19:12
Sure.
12:19:14
You may answer the question.
12:19:14 dont recall.
12:19:15
Okay.
Farther down the paragraph
12:19:17
states, S/ES conducts annual workshops with the
12:19:22
agency agency records officer records
12:19:26
management for departing senior officials and their
12:19:31
staffs.
12:19:33
Such workshops were held February 2007,
September 2008, June 2009, April 2010, October 2011,
12:19:37
October 2012, and October 2013.
12:19:43
Did you attend the did you attend
12:19:47
either the workshops October 2011 October
12:19:49
2012?
12:19:55
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
Scope, and
compound.
12:19:56
12:19:57
You may answer the question.
12:19:59
No.
12:20:00 you know Mrs. Clinton attended
12:20:00
either those workshops?
MR. MYERS:
Objection.
12:20:07
Scope.
You may answer the question.
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106 dont know.
Though would
surprised.
staff.
officer is?
12:20:33 the State Department?
12:20:35 the State yes.
12:20:36
This normally targeted clerical
12:20:15
12:20:18
12:20:21
Okay. you know who the agency records the time
12:20:21
the time you were